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British identity cards

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Post by houndsoflove13 Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:02 pm

British identity cards will be covered in EU symbols

Britain's first identity card in more than half a century was unveiled yesterday - and turned out to be covered in EU symbols to satisfy Brussels.

The plastic card, which will be issued to foreign citizens in Britain starting in November, marks the first stage in the Government's ambitious scheme to issue biometric ID cards to all UK residents at a cost of billions of pounds.

But serious questions remain over whether the system will work or bring any practical benefits, and doubts were underlined yesterday as the Conservatives pledged to scrap the entire venture if they win the next General Election.

British identity cards Article-1061761-02CBAF5900000578-626_468x278

ID cards have finally been unveiled - with plenty of EU symbols to satisfy Brussels

Foreigners issued with the cards will not have to show them to get a job or use services such as the NHS and schools, and it remains unclear if or when public services or private firms will install computerised scanners to make use of the costly biometric technology.

The card revealed by Home Secretary Jacqui Smith yesterday features a picture of a bull above EU- style golden stars, while the coloured background is made up of hundreds of tiny letters spelling 'EU'. The bull is a European Union symbol drawn from Greek mythology.

Last night the Home Office admitted that British ID cards had to follow a common design as set out in a Brussels directive to ensure that every card issued by EU states looks similar.

Each card, which will cost £30, carries unique biometric data in the form of a photograph and the individual's fingerprints stored digitally.

Miss Smith said up to 60,000 cards will be distributed by next March to non-EU foreign citizens resident in Britain as they renew their visas. These cardswill be compulsory.

Ministers hope the first cards for British citizens, featuring a slightly different design, will be issued next year, starting with workers in sensitive locations such as ' airside' staff at UK airports. These will also be compulsory, but airport operators and unions object strongly, and could yet scupper the plans.

From 2010 the Government will encourage all young Britons to apply for a card on a voluntary basis, extending the scheme to all citizens and foreign residents from 2011.

British identity cards Article-1061761-02CCAFF300000578-71_468x414

Ministers hope that when enough people have cards Parliament will agree to make them compulsory.

They claim the scheme will cost £4.7billion in its first ten years, although that does not include the substantial cost of installing scanners at huge numbers of sites including NHS clinics, town halls and benefits offices to check identities and entitlements.

Miss Smith insisted the cards would protect against identity fraud, illegal working, and help people prove their identity easily.

Critics claim the failure to make the cards universal for foreign citizens makes a mockery of the supposed security benefits.

Shadow home secretary Dominic Grieve dismissed the entire scheme as an 'expensive white elephant' which should be ditched.

He said: 'Ministers are kidding themselves if they think ID cards for foreign nationals will protect against illegal immigration or terrorism.'

Liberal Democrat spokesman Chris Huhne said: 'It does not matter how fancy the design is, ID cards remain a grotesque intrusion on the liberty of the British people.

'The Government is using vulnerable members of our society, like foreign nationals who do not have the vote, as guinea pigs for a deeply unpopular and unworkable policy.

'When voting adults are forced to carry ID cards, this scheme will prove to be a laminated poll tax.'




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Well I'm not a fan of this at all. We know that we have an abundance of crime, theft and id fraud etc; and what they've been able to do with these id cards is use example after example of it will protect you here and make it easier to do this and that. And then the sheeple all follow and believe that the billions they waste will be worth it coz it will protect you.

No it will hardly protect you at all. It will more likely make it easier for fraud and crime as it won't be the hardest thing to get data or replicas of these cards.

I hate this idea and I hate that Jacqui Smith; something about her I really don't like.
I won't feel any safer with one of these cards just another headache if my data is stolen or copied etc...

More and more I think our economy is being preped so it collapses and we all beg to join the Euro currency and join the EU fully.
gits... 2121212
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Post by Bennett Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:40 pm

I don't like the ID cards but chasing criminals myself I think everyones DNA and fingerprints should be kept on a police database along with last known address etc. the systems in place at the moment make it too easy to slip through the net. (of which I have seen plenty of)
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Post by Alexisonline Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:45 pm

Eugh, just eugh.
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Post by EG0FILTER Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:56 pm

I have serious mixed feelings about the whole identity card and DNA library thing. I also have serious misgivings about the level of CCTV in this country. I do think levels of control are needed unfortunately, but I just dont trust the powers behind them,,, right now its not such a problem, but the future is unsure and these are the first steps into a 'brave new world'. I dont think cards will achieve what they are designed to acheive, but I do feel that they are wide open for abuse.
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Post by Shred Fri Nov 28, 2008 4:00 pm

1984 anyone next this goverment will bring are anti emotion drugs and if they think I'm £90 for a piece of plastic they can fuck right off, got enough to pay for already. If they want them made compulsory they should give them away for free and paid for by the overpaid politicans that have broken this fucking country.
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Post by Dongziller Fri Nov 28, 2008 4:17 pm

yeah i'd never pay for one, they'd have to force it on me
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Post by houndsoflove13 Fri Nov 28, 2008 4:30 pm

Bennett wrote:I don't like the ID cards but chasing criminals myself I think everyones DNA and fingerprints should be kept on a police database along with last known address etc. the systems in place at the moment make it too easy to slip through the net. (of which I have seen plenty of)

True chap, but you take finger prints of criminals. I think that is fine, most criminals start young and their finger prints are taken. I have my finger prints taken down a long time ago when I stole a CD from HMV, lol (was 15)...I learned my lesson. 2121212

How is this gonna work. DNA database is nice and all but a DNA/fingerprint database is best for criminals. If you have everybodys (innocent and all) it makes them easier to target by criminals.

Its not hard to put somebody else in a guilty dna situation. Just picking up somebodies fag butt-end or something similar and planting it at the site of a crime, can be enough to get somebody else involved.

Criminals very rarely become criminals overnight. So taking their DNA/fingerprints when frist charged with soem crime should be enough.

I've seen many examples on how these things can be abused and the only thing this scheme seems to protect is the innocent from the innocent who will unlikely do crime. The real criminals actually have more and better oppurtunities once they have stolen an identity in some way.
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Post by houndsoflove13 Fri Nov 28, 2008 4:34 pm

Dongziller wrote:yeah i'd never pay for one, they'd have to force it on me

lol...Anyone know who were the first people to mass enforce id cards...?

Aye...tis the lovely Nazi's...bless them...

They can't force it but they can make it impossible not to have one.
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Post by EG0FILTER Fri Nov 28, 2008 4:40 pm

I got arrested last year,,, nothing serious, no charges.... but on arrest you get DNA swabbed,,, along with prints if not already on file...
this I find disgusting... only after a conviction should this information be taken and stored.

And the ID card.... well mabey its cynicle paranioa,,,, I work for the local council, this council plan to use the id card when it comes as a means to access all council buildings.... ok, fine. As long as its staff. But one of the options being considered is to make the Libraries staffless, you swipe your id card, go in take a book and leave. A scanner system of some description will monitor what books leave with what id card.... two problems,,, first job losses,,, yet another job replaced by technology,,, secondly... now theres an instant record of what you are reading,,, information control, monitoring, flagging,,,, I think its scary shit.
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Post by houndsoflove13 Fri Nov 28, 2008 5:00 pm

Ah jeez they'll see me hireing out Jenny Does Dallas...lol

We live in complicated times and giving up our freedom may make some feel safer. I just think Orwell was right and giving up our freedoms is something I thought we were fighting for and the terrorists/bogeymen were jealous of.

Internet will be next. I think Canada is starting their new internet service in next 2 years where everything is controlled via filters, little like China has. Don't we laugh at china though when it comes to freedom....hmmmm double standards.
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Post by Bennett Fri Nov 28, 2008 5:02 pm

To be honest Ego i work in the COurt system it took them years to develop a new system which they implemented in Feb to us and still doing throughout the country but its quite obvious the people developing these systems are still stuck in the past and they are very basic, Still VERY user dependant. I don't think we'll see the governement achieve anything like this within any of our lifetimes.
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Post by ozzy0308 Fri Nov 28, 2008 5:05 pm

so it was you that master-minded the whole millenium dome diamond theft job , i'd heard they had arrested Mr Big but could'nt make it stick, wer'nt you involved in that securicor job to, the one where there did'nt find all the money,, ahh so now i know whats in the allotment its all coming to together now... like pieces of giant criminal jigsaw... fess up now ego ,if you can't do the time don't do the crime.....
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Post by EG0FILTER Fri Nov 28, 2008 7:44 pm

The allotment is where the loot is burried.....

and Bennet,,, yes I agree,,, I doubt we have anything to really worry about in the near future,, but I think its a slippery slope, and we as citezens need to be involved early on,,, easier to squash somthing in infancy than once it gathers momentum.... Revolution Brother!!!
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Post by Rossinio Fri Nov 28, 2008 8:58 pm

Well, I'm not for the whole DNA, Hair, Fingernail, Urine, and god knows what other samples to be stored on a Database, but I do strongly believe that EVERYONE should be issued with a Free Photographic ID card, stating at least Name and Date of Birth - which needs to be renewed every 2 years or so. This would make IDing people so much easier in pubs, clubs, cinemas and in shops when underage people try buying games. It gets tiresome to hear people complain "I'm only 13, what ID can I get" to which you reply "Erm...Passport...Parent? Or Spend a Fiver and get a CitizenCard, which is just plain crap". If everyone was forced to have a basic card like that, no-one could complain, or try and trick the system.
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Post by houndsoflove13 Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:53 pm

Least they found a good way of getting your kids DNA tested...lol
Sorry I know this probably seems like a good idea to some but what a load of *bleep*.



Parents offered £100 DNA test to find future sports stars



By Daily Mail Reporter
Last updated at 1:13 AM on 01st December 2008




Parents are being offered a £100 DNA test which promises to reveal which sport their child is most suited to play.
British identity cards Article-0-02A51E20000005DC-500_468x286

Sports stars: Parents are being offered a DNA test to see what sports their children will be good at


Kevin Reilly of Atlas Sports Genetics, the U.S. firm offering the test, said it used gene analysis to determine if a child would be best at speed and power sports, such as football or sprinting, or endurance sports such as running.
However, genetics experts urged caution.

One said: 'This is a new version of snake oil.'
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Post by TL Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:23 pm

AlterEgofilter wrote:I have serious mixed feelings about the whole identity card and DNA library thing. I also have serious misgivings about the level of CCTV in this country...

It will be another item that can be counterfeited and used for either false identities or ID theft. Also, whether CCTV is need or not, it is shocking when you realise how saturated CCTV camera's are. Your 'Average Joe' really is not aware how easy their movements can be tracked. In fact, we are so used to 'seeing' these camera's that we don't even notice that they are there.

This level of surveillance was not present in the old Eastern bloc! As usual the line trotted out is "If you're not doing anything wrong, why worry?" It's all about control. 1984 has been here for some time now and will get worse.
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Post by Frogpubs Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:30 pm

The fundamental problem with ID cards is the same as for passports/driving licences etc - it WILL be forged. How difficult will it then be to clear your name if your ID card has been used fraudulently? Plus its just more information for the Government to lose and they want us to pay for it.
How an earth will it stop terrorism? Excuse me Sir, may I see your ID card before your rucksack blows up?
It drives me mental. 1111
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Post by houndsoflove13 Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:47 pm

Its been nuts for a long time.
I guess the neo-cons and thatcherists etc, go back to pretty much the World War II time, maybe even further back.

I think people find it hard to believe that people from those times can still hold power now, but thats what families and clubs are for. Progressing their "family" to the top where it remains.
Its like the old Rome Club....

In some ways I dont care I will just live my life and bring my family up as best as I can. But I now fear that over the next 10 years things are gonna change for the worst.
I'm not sure if its just the way things are and mankinds own fault coz of its nature of greed.
Or if its much worse and its down to crazy fundamentalist (religious nutters) who are in power and believe the end is nigh even if they have to cause the apocolypse. The latter is the most barmy but then again the people running the world are crazy evangelicals, far right catholics and zionists with crazy agendas.

Anyway enough of that crap.
Most important thing is too not get fearful, paranoid and hateful.
But to still help your friends, family, neighbours and to try and enjoy life. But always keep your eyes and ears open...
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Post by Dongziller Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:52 pm

i do agree with the CCTV actually, i know it invades my privacy but there's so many muggers and kids carryin knives now! especially round Chester the amount of smack heads and homeless is shockin and the fights from clubs are harsh, worse than liverpool i hear which is just fuckin frightful
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Post by houndsoflove13 Tue Dec 02, 2008 3:02 pm

Its hard to say Dong.
I see your point, but people who are gonna do harm are gonna do harm. You cant have a CCTV everywhere (well you can if you have our governement). They'll just find somewhere else or some way around it..

Also most cases that go to court do not use cctv footage as evidence. Theres a reason why i read it somewhere but cant remember what it said.

I do agree though on certain premises. Like a school, college, bar, pubs.
That maybe exceptable...

But I'd much rather more cops on street and more respect in our society (total society change to do that). The next generation and the generation of kids just below me have got right attitude problems.
I mean I was a rebel but i still had respect.

I think you just have to go on XboxLive to get ah idea of the idiots out there...lol
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Post by Frogpubs Tue Dec 02, 2008 3:30 pm

Its never been the same since Nick Ross from Crimeswatch stopped saying "Dont have nightmares - do sleep well"!! I never sleep a wink anymore British identity cards 38888

Slightly off topic but on CCTV - Dont get me started on average speed cameras on motorways! uzigunner
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Post by houndsoflove13 Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:24 pm

Many countries have no speed limits and cameras and they have far less accidents thank UK...
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Post by Shred Wed Dec 03, 2008 7:06 pm

Motorists = Easy money, fecking goverment robbing us all blind, can't wait to see what they say on Top Gear about this.
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Post by Guest Wed Dec 03, 2008 7:43 pm

Official road accidents have gone up 15% and 10% of them this year Eastern european immigrants were involved (as reported in the Express early last week)
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