Chavez acts over US-Bolivia row

Not sure if people know much of the history of South America over the last 30 years but its pretty much been a US testing ground for creating juntas, opposing militia's, defeating socialist governments, pushing capitalism and free markets (which don't work at all for developing countries as free markets collapse their own economies and multinationals can come in and buy out everything dirt cheap).

So I'm a small fan of Chavez. The papers find a lot of shit on him and use propaganda to stir things up. But the people their adore him and America so far has been unable to shift him, and they have tried.

I dont expect USA yet will get involved they use other so called democratic countries like Colombia to do their bidding and causing unrest and creating militia's against the government.

Its a sham what the USA has done to most of South America, collapsing economies when its not going their way. Dirty wars...

Anyway Venezuela is basically the next Cuba especially with its Russian ties, and I see tension rising in the next year or 2.
I always believe what comes around goes around so the US administration has a lot to answer for over the last 100 years.

I mean when will America give Mexico all its land back on the South/West coast, the USA stole it in one of the most unjust wars ever. It seems to feel like it can tell other countries to give back areas and not include its self, similar to its invasion policies.
If this isnt Imperialistic I don't know what is.
LOL Rant over...



Chavez acts over US-Bolivia row

Mr Chavez also threatened to oil supplies to the US
Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez is expelling the US envoy to Caracas, amid an escalating regional diplomatic row.

Mr Chavez said US ambassador Patrick Duddy had 72 hours to leave, adding the move was in solidarity with Bolivia.

It came just hours after Washington ordered out the Bolivian ambassador, in response to its own envoy being told to leave Bolivia.

Bolivia accuses the US envoy of inciting growing violent protests against President Evo Morales.

At least eight people were killed and some 20 injured in clashes between pro- and anti-government groups in Bolivia on Thursday.

Bolivia has seen large numbers of protests in recent weeks by opponents of Mr Morales's economic and social policies.

'Go to hell'

President Chavez used coarse language to describe his feelings about Washington as he ordered the expulsion of US envoy Patrick Duddy.


Violence has flared in eastern Bolivia


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"The Yankee ambassador to Caracas has 72 hours to leave Venezuela, in solidarity with Bolivia, with the Bolivian people, and with the Bolivian government," Mr Chavez said.

"Go to hell 100 times," he said.

Mr Chavez also announced that he was recalling his envoy from Washington.

Earlier, the US state department declared that the Bolivian ambassador in Washington, Gustavo Guzman, was "persona non grata".

State department spokesman Sean McCormack said the decision was taken "in response to unwarranted actions, and in accordance with the Vienna Convention [on diplomatic protocol]".

He referred to Wednesday's move by Bolivia to expel US Ambassador Philip Goldberg.

President Morales accused Mr Goldberg of "conspiring against democracy" and encouraging the break-up of Bolivia, but Mr McCormack said the expulsion was a "grave error", describing the accusations as "baseless".

Military protection

The eight deaths in Bolivia's remote northern jungle region of Pando happened as pro- and anti-government protesters fought each other with clubs, machetes and firearms, officials said.


Mr Morales wants to carry out land reforms to bring wealth to poor areas

Seven of the victims were farmers killed by opposition activists, reports say.

A government spokesman described the killings as a massacre.

Protesters have also been blocking roads and occupying buildings in eastern regions, which are home to Bolivia's important natural gas reserves.

Opposition groups want greater autonomy as well as more control over revenues of natural gas in their areas.

They object to Mr Morales's plans to give more power to the country's indigenous and poor communities, by carrying out land reform and redistributing gas revenues.

On Monday, the government announced it was sending the military to protect gas fields and infrastructure from demonstrators and guarantee exports to neighbouring countries.

On Wednesday, officials said saboteurs had caused a blast on a pipeline, forcing them to cut natural gas exports to neighbouring Brazil by 10%.

The Brazilian foreign ministry said in a statement that the government was taking the necessary measures to guarantee gas supplies in the country.

The statement also expressed Brazil's "grave concern" at the events in Bolivia, and deplored the outbreak of violence and attacks on state institutions and public order.

I was brought up in Venezuela and my Dad and his alternate family still live over there.

Although it's nice to see someone standing up those dopey colonials it must be understood that Chavez is.......A TOTAL AND UTTER NUTTER!!
Seriously, the guy is slightly deranged.

Some of the recent changes he's made in the capital alone include:

1) Anyone with more than one fridge / freezer / oven / TV - basically anything electrical - had to take them down to the central plaza in Caracas so it could be given to someone else. This obviously didn't apply to anyone in government or any of his chums.

2) And this one's a doozy, anyone with an unused bedroom in their house in the capital they had to take in a person or people from the barrios for free.

3) He recently tried to get legislation through that meant he would never have to end his presidency - at the moment it's a 6 year term and there's only one re-election. Also within in it was a clause that gave the president sole control of the country's banks!!

4) The enforced take over of the country's refineries and oil fields, basically he just went to all th big oil companies and told them to accept the - considerably lower than actual price - buyout offers or to have them aken over by the military.

5) The creation of communes on pre-established farms. He kicked owners of farms of their land and gave them to a bunch of totally untrained layabouts to run as they please. At the moment in Caracas my Dad et al can't buy fresh bread, milk (except for the powdered stuff, which is actually quite nice), eggs, flour or beef. I mean beef and milk for gods sake!! Venezuela is known for three things: oil, gold and cows.

I could go on for a while about this chap but I'd better stop now because I can feel a vein in my neck going and I don't want to have a "Gareth Thomas" moment.

Yes the great unwashed and the presidential lackeys love him. I've been over there when Fidel visited and the place just goes nuts and we all know how well he did for Cuba! But everyone else, the people who keep the country running don't because he is a total loon.

Rant over....

Ok, hang on, one more thing. As Colombo says.

He has complete power over the nations TV networks....I mean complete.....at any time of day or night he can have them switched off. If he doesn't like a reporter or a programme he turns them off. He recently banned the Simpsons because they give a bad moralistic example for kids. Wait a mo, hasn't the Simpsons won loads of awards for havnig a clear and clever moral to every episode?? He also takes over the main TV station every day for anywhere between an hour and five hours to give his little speaches. In a classic case he took over a station for over an hour to explain why he wasn't going to spend his valuable time answering to a question that had been put to him by an American reporter.

*takes deep breath*

Don't get me wrong, I do like him a little bit but he really is a coulpe of gherkins short of a Big Mac.

No doubt I agree with much of the stuff you says.
He certainly isnt perfect but he puts his people of the land first, and unfortunately good people who are their to be apart of the country like your family are dragged into changes that he puts on the gits from ol' USA who try and manipulate the country.


Its similar to Zimababwe, Cuba and Peru where I visited 2 years ago.

Its difficult to grab and though I say I do like him in some respects I totally dislike him for the reasons you mentioned.

I'm a liberal person and believe in the independance of the press and our freedoms and Chavez's is no better than our controlled media.
But for different reasons I feel. He controls it as it would be used by USA et al to create propaganda against him.
The US would of ahd him out by now if it wasnt for that.

To be honest all the free from US, untouched countries left are run now by morons, dictators etc etc. The good rulers of teh countries have been booted out like (cant remember his name) ruler of Chile before he was assassinated by a CIA driven militia take over. Sam ein Argentina and other places. The good guys go quick easy to get rid of.
The big bad guys actually stick around coz they knwo the rules better.

Chavez is a fool and sometimes an idiot but the pressure and sanctions and manipualtion of the economy by the USA and its branches is enough to cause him to act like a prat at times.

And him taking over the Oil fields/refineries (imo) a blessing to the people of venzuela.

Sorry I disagree with you their, and I'm sorry for any overseas guys who work on the fields to make a living as they are just doing their job.

But the USA unfairly manipulated most of S.America to gain gas/oil/natural resources via forced free trade and capitalism which forced many countries to sell off their land resources for F*** All.
Which is not exceptable at all.

Chavez in this respect is a hero to the people of Venezuela, are they seeing the benefits, in some respects yes and others no.
I think the money made for the Venezuelan economy from the resources would be far less if USA monopolies still had huge ties to them.

Its nice to bicker with you Lemony.
I'm all ears to always see all sides and I'm glad you do too.
This is how the World should be...

I just think your family like many farm families in Zimbabwe are caught in between a revolutionary governement pushing for changes and a twatty ass power governement holding on to something thats not theres.

No fair, I just did a little post and for some reason it hasn't shown up...

...I shall try to replicate.

Venezuela is a great country, anywhere that has won more Miss Worlds / Universes / Internationals than any other place has to be good.

They even elected an ex Miss World as their version of an MP in the area I lived in.

Shame it's run by someone who has 50% good ideas and 50% bonkers / loopy ideas.

Someone in government should get a really big rolled up newspaper and when he comes out with something a bit left of centre he should be bopped on the nose whike being told "bad El Presidente, bad!".

Don't forget last year he paid London £7 million pounds so we could help him with the buses in Caracas....seriously....money that should be going to the poor over there and he gave it to us. Luckily good old Boris saw that as the pile of poo it is and gave it all back this year.

I can't agree wholly with the oil side though, yes the septics crept in with dodgy deals but they wouldn't have been able to get them if it hadn't been for Chavez-esque prior president. Also he's not running them properly still, keeps on putting lackeys with little or no experience in and is surpried when things go phhuutttt.

You know I said 50 / 50? I might change that to 70 / 30 in favour of bad ideas.

I think we should send Maggie to sort him out.

Christ on a stick, this is almost like grown up talk.

Ah nah! Maggie? Can't stand the wench.
Selling off a countries public sectors isn't what I call good ideas.
Wasnt for the Falklands she would have been out come next election, that saved her (hmm sound familiar Georgie Bush)...

The oil boom in Venezuela 80's was a total farce and most of the GDP money was taken out of the country. Also the country went into mass decline because of the selling off of land and extraction of wealth. It works this way a mass boom, streets buzzing, buildings being built, hope etc... only problem the boom is being sucked of its wealth and instead of it circulating back into teh country and el circa it gets sucked dry.

Thats when all went tits up and the economy crashed never recovered.
Since then its been pretty bad, but on the up in the last 6 years with lower unemployment, lower inflation, better GDP per capita, better wages.
Its obviously not perfect but things always will be difficult when you close your markets piss off USA, IMF, World Banks etc etc and they start to fuck with your amrkets and manipulate things...

I tell you what though chap.
How is Venezuela you visit much? Its a place I really wanna visit.
Peru was amazing and the work I did out their was soo much fun.
Venezuela is a aplace I'd love to visit.

I refer you to my earlier comment about the Miss Worlds etc.

The place is brilliant plus you have an English accent so you'll be hard-pressed not to be engaged to marry if you're there for more than 23 minutes!!

They hate the septics with an understandable passion - I've known Americans who've lived there for 20 years and never bothered to learn the language, always go to American bars and American shops - but they LOVE all things Britsih because we always have integrated with the locals. I used to go to Venezuelan schools.

I still have loads of contacts out there even though it's been a few years since I was last there and can easily hook you up with some quality people especially on the islands. I have a couple of them on face-space if you want introductions.

As far as they economy though I can remember when they stopped using coins because the metal was worth more than the coin itself. This led to 1 bolivar notes (the same as 0.01 pence in real money) and when we got on buses instead of change the drivers would give you either boiled sweets or boiled eggs. Brilliant except that if you caught the buses that had been running for a few hours they did have a certain tang in the air :uyyt:

Yeah in Peru they loved us Brits not so much most of the yanks we were with. We invented their most popular drink Inca Cola which out sells Coke so that pisses off Mr Coca Cola. yay!!

The people were very friendly to us and I guess its the British manner of trying to understand them and our politness they like.
I worked in a school in a shanty town for a month in Villa El Salvador and it was brilliant. I got to see the real side of Peru and not just the nice touristy areas of Lima that are basically Spain in architect.

I'd imagine Venezuela is similar in folks, so friendly. There is obvious danger but every country has that especially where poverty is prominent.
My missus friend had her glasses stolen but the thief brought them back when he found out we was in the neighbourhood helping out the locals and working with them. I know its not accepatable any type of stealing but it was toching non the less.

I def wanna go back to South America and Venezuela, maybe Guyana are 2 spots I may look into.
We also went to Bonaire (Netherland Antilles) which is just off of Venezuela. Nice place but bloody awful winds, lol...

They are pretty much alike.

I was working out on Margarita Island a few years ago and yup, very bloomin' windy.

It does have one of the top 5 beaches for wind / kite surfing though and a penchant for one-piece bikinis!!!!

Oh to be twenty years younger, single and over there again.

Though I'm happily taken...

Some nice looking ladies I agree.

Hey, as far as I'm concerned I use the "diet" method of getting away with admiring the laydeez.

Just because I'm on a diet doesn't mean I can't look at food!

Plus my Mrs is the most beautiful woman in the world and everyone else comes up short when measured against her *looks around in a shifty manner because I wouldn't put it past her to have found a way of checking up on what I'm posting*

lol nice piece, though i find it hard to judge other countries like the US when Britain was the biggest bastard of them all, Colonising the globe to rob other countries riches and leave them with bugger all, this sort of thing has happened for hundreds of years

I agree if you want to start going backwards then the Mongolians have a hell of a lot to answer for, their empire went from China to Poland!

Naughty Khans.

I think the main difference is that in this day and age we are supposed to know better. I know it sounds a bit odd but at least in the olden days we poor misguided Europeans conquered everyone because we knew that people with different coloured skin were of an inferior race and needed looking after.

I know a lot of the US is quite backward (we need a smiley for "window lickers") but even they know that's not the case yet they still do it...or try to do it in some cases.

Aye us Brits were the last great imperialistic empire its just a shame that USA is now taking that mould too.

Difference being is they use NATO, IMF, World Bank and Military stationed bases and other forms of branches to govern countries.

I dont wanna go down a long discussion of USA primacies. I'd recommend actually reading books by Brziesinki and other US Military leaders to actually see even from the horses mouth that they have imperialistic goals.

I'm not looking forward to the next few years. Things are changing quickly.
Dots are connecting and I dont give 2 shits as theirs nothing I can do but keep a sound mind and widely open.

lol... something to lighten the mood...

read - confessions of an economic hitman, superb read

Confessions of an Economic Hit Man is a book written by John Perkins and published in 2004. It tells the story of his career with consulting firm Chas. T. Main. Before employment with the firm, he interviewed for a job with the National Security Agency (NSA). Perkins claims that this interview effectively constituted an independent screening which led to his subsequent hiring by Einar Greve, a member of the firm (and alleged NSA liaison) to become a self-described "Economic Hit Man."

According to his book, Perkins' function was to convince the political and financial leadership of underdeveloped countries to accept enormous development loans from institutions like the World Bank and USAID. Saddled with huge debts they could not hope to pay, these countries were forced to acquiesce to political pressure from the United States on a variety of issues. Perkins argues in his book that developing nations were effectively neutralized politically, had their wealth gaps driven wider and economies crippled in the long run. In this capacity Perkins recounts his meetings with some prominent individuals, including Graham Greene and Omar Torrijos. Perkins describes the role of an EHM as follows:

Economic hit men (EHMs) are highly paid professionals who cheat countries around the globe out of trillions of dollars. They funnel money from the World Bank, the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID), and other foreign "aid" organizations into the coffers of huge corporations and the pockets of a few wealthy families who control the planet's natural resources. Their tools included fraudulent financial reports, rigged elections, payoffs, extortion, sex, and murder. They play a game as old as empire, but one that has taken on new and terrifying dimensions during this time of globalization.

highly recommended mate

I need a new book and thats sounds pretty awesome...cheers

I just read a nice and simple book on the USA administration and its aspirations.
Shock Doctrine (Naomi Klein). She wrote No Logo which was a great book for pissing off the multinationals.

Tis a good book for people who wanna just start down the rabbit hole.
I really enjoyed it, though it wasnt massively indepth it looked at the whole thing from a high view point...

Sounds all terribly high-brow.

I've just started The Very Hungry Caterpillar by Eric Carle

crackin read the hungry caterpiller mate, i won't spoil it for ya but he likes his grub